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wicked93gs

1966 Mustang 3.7L V6 swap

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My alternative psuedo-flange method. These are 2" exhaust flanges...unlike the washers, they are 5/16" thick...enough to hold a thread...using them does mean adding 1/4" or so to the horn height, but they are much more solid...I do still need a rubber-to-steel bonding epoxy however.

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I feel your pain on space limitations.  That is why my runners ended up shorter than they should have been and the airbox was smaller than I would have liked it to have been.

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I went ahead and tried liquid nails just for fun on the rubber to metal bonding project...epic fail there, knew it was going to be...but I did get a lead on on some marine adhesive people swear by:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000Y89JC8/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

It has a 7 day cure time and is said to be pretty much unbreakable once cured...I ordered some and went ahead an cut down these exhaust flanges to better fit and drilled them out...need to find my metric taps so I can thread them.

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I will take the 1/4" hood clearance deficit...already have to scoop the hood...what difference does another 1/4" make really? Since this airbox process will take so long though, I may well end up making some new air horns out of 2" aluminum mandrel bends use an exhaust pipe expanding tool to attach them to some velocity stacks of the correct diameter...2" is the maximum OD I can go with and still have them be able to cross past each other....unless I put them in a vice and crush them slightly at that point for clearance...but that would do bad things for flow and probably reduce the inside volume to that same 45-48mm

 

 

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20200217_093509_zpsx7jciuam.jpg

I used 3M Marine 5200 to glue the cut-down couplers to the flanges....this seems to have done the trick...its a viable method...and now that I have found a simple method anyone can do....I am turning to something else entirely:

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Not bad for a hand-cut flange using just a hole saw and an angle grinder is it?

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I gave in and decided the best bet was to weld a 3/8" aluminum flange to each throttle body...not that I have welded any of them yet...need a couple hours practicing on the TIG before I attempt it...throttle bodies are one part I really don't want to mess up....besides I have to disassemble them all first to be able to get the room I need to get the TIG torch and filler rod around the throttle springs.

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20200218_163356_zps4tpyz1cv.jpg

So the Weber carb velocity stacks came in today....A conundrum here...the inside diameter at the flange is 45mm....the Inside diameter of the aluminum tubing I am going to be using is 47mm...and the ITBs at the throttle plate are 50mm. I am not worried about the slight increase in size at the throttle plate because the only time that will be anything but positive pressure is going to be WOT...and WOT any drop in velocity is going to be insignificant enough I should be able to ignore it...but that isnt the case in a transition from 45-47mm right after the bellmouth...its going to hurt velocity...the question is simply whether its going to be significant. There are a couple solutions though...I can cut the stacks up the flange about an inch or so...I calculate that ID at that point will be 47mm...but that leaves me without a flange, though I suppose I can weld the ears of the flange back onto it afterward...if I didnt need an airbox or common filter for each box, I could simply flare the end of the aluminum pipe with an exhaust pipe expander tool and slip the bellmouth into it in a press fit(I suppose I can do that anyway really....with a press fit I don't actually need a flange for anything but a backing plate anyway...and that flange can be welded to the pipe itself)

I can also cut the flange off flush and expand the bottom of the velocity stack to 47mm with the exhaust flare tool...but I am simply not sure how uniformly those exhaust tools really flare a pipe.

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20200219_164015_zpsff59wtkc.jpg

The aluminum intercooler piping came in today(velocity stack tubing). In this picture, the tubing length is actually 2" or so longer than the BMW stacks. What do you think Unclenard? What length should I make my runners? Stock length from the head surface to the plenum is roughly 15" or so...the length in the picture posted above is about the same...however the stock runners taper most of the distance...these do not taper until they hit the throttle bodies...so if I made them the same length I would not gain anything on the low end really...I would just needlessly choke the top end. I have some latitude here to go shorter...the question is how much shorter am I able to go and still retain good torque under the majority of the curve?

 

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Looks like I have a significant amount of TIG welding to do this weekend once I settle on runner length.

 

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Here is a calculator for runners that I used:

http://www.exx.se/techinfo/runners/runners.html

Cylinder bore 95.5
Cylinder stroke 86.7
Duration intake valve (degrees) I had to guess as I couldn't find what value range that can be from the VCT and I can't find what number I used.

The other numbers you should know based on what you are doing or wanting.

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One thing I wasn't sure about too is if you start measuring the runner length from the valves actually instead of from the port on the head.  I assumed it was from the valves and measured it to be somewhere around 5" from the valves to the head port.

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yeah...I got that same valve to port measurement last time I had the ITBs off...one thing I have to keep in mind though is that while air horns are very similar to intake manifold runners...they arent exactly the same...the location of the throttle plate changes some characteristics . The VCT also plays into this in a huge way...a lot of people with ITBs will just throw on whatever air horn fits, and then use aftermarket camshafts to complement them...in this case, I suspect that both this ITB setup and your own fabbed manifold would greatly benefit from re-tuning the VCT....neither one is going to be even close to the characteristics of a stock manifold....so your manifold really might not have failed nearly as bad as you first assumed...you never changed the VCT settings. I think you should try again with some data logging to see what is really going on.

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This weekend I did some work on getting flanges on the throttle bodies. While there is nothing technically wrong with the coupler setup, by adding true flanges, if I ever choose to use forced induction on the car, I eliminate a lot of possible boost leaks:

 

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I beveled the inside slightly to gain more clearance for the fuel rail...last thing I need is some crazy rubbing that punctures the rail and spills gas all over the engine bay.

 

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And then...ran out of argon for the TIG...but at least I got the tubing tacked to the flanges...the clocking here is critical...I have almost no space between the tubes in a crossover setup...and the crossover setup is needed to maximize room within the shock tower brace.

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This weekend I did some work on getting flanges on the throttle bodies. While there is nothing technically wrong with the coupler setup, by adding true flanges, if I ever choose to use forced induction on the car, I eliminate a lot of possible boost leaks:
 
20200228_143732_zpsflreg95n.jpg
 
20200229_093800_zpsywtd62ya.jpg
 
20200229_100351_zpsp8ruvn69.jpg
 
20200229_104004_zpsorvth8nv.jpg
 
20200229_120318_zpsyif7br35.jpg
 
I beveled the inside slightly to gain more clearance for the fuel rail...last thing I need is some crazy rubbing that punctures the rail and spills gas all over the engine bay.
 
20200229_123327_zpsjokmwlsc.jpg
 
20200229_125622_zpsza1gymvj.jpg
 
And then...ran out of argon for the TIG...but at least I got the tubing tacked to the flanges...the clocking here is critical...I have almost no space between the tubes in a crossover setup...and the crossover setup is needed to maximize room within the shock tower brace.

Epic! So epic.


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Unclenard....do you still have that Ecoboost 3.5 coolant crossover and coolant pipe you were using with your manifold? If so, interested in offloading them? I am collecting the parts needed to start the engine on the stand, and those 2 are on the list.

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18 hours ago, wicked93gs said:

Unclenard....do you still have that Ecoboost 3.5 coolant crossover and coolant pipe you were using with your manifold? If so, interested in offloading them? I am collecting the parts needed to start the engine on the stand, and those 2 are on the list.

I do and would.  I'll get them out of the garage today and send you pics because I had to cut a little off of the crossover for it to fit the intake flange.  The mounting holes are a bit different on the one side.

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I am sure I will need the same area cut for the adapter plates...they are pretty close in shape and size to your flanges after all. Did you re-drill and tap the head out of curiosity for the different ecoboost 3.5 bolt pattern?

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20200306_165402_zpsvvmlpoek.jpg

Still having trouble welding aluminum...no real surprise there, just starting out TIG welding aluminum and don't have enough experience for this particular task...I may well re-start and outsource this task...or rather, outsource the initial set of stacks while I practice welding more to make my own(since I would like to have several different lengths available) I am getting better...but aluminum is so soft that I have collapsed several pieces already putting too much heat into them and I am getting tired of re-making flanges and wasting tubing.

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Welding aluminum is the easiest way to turn metal into Swiss cheese. Lol. I have only done it for about 2 total hours worth of time, including set up, dick around, blow some holes, blow more holes, and then move on to stainless lol.

It was ~10 years ago in freshmen intro to welding. Gooooood times.


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I wish I could offer some advice but I have zero experience welding.  I took my intake to a welder and paid a lot more than I would have liked but I had no option and he did a great job.

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On 3/11/2020 at 8:20 AM, Unclenard said:

I wish I could offer some advice but I have zero experience welding.  I took my intake to a welder and paid a lot more than I would have liked but I had no option and he did a great job.

 

Did you ever manage to dig out that ecoboost 3.5L water tube and crossover pipe? Getting close now to when I will need them:

 

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Stripping the wiring down to the bare minimum at this point so its just those water pipes and some flexplate/flywheel pieces I need to get the engine to a point I can turn it over and hopefully get it idling.....well, and some type of temp fuel pump to hook up to a gas jug.

 

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Here are pictures of them.  Just a slight corner cut off of one of the mounting holes.

 

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IMG_20200317_153950.jpg

IMG_20200317_153959.jpg

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2 hours ago, wicked93gs said:

Works for me, just get me a price shipped to 37033 and your email and I can send a paypal payment

I sent you a message through the site.

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